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What the hell HR!

James Webber

What the hell HR!

Can someone tell me how I’m meant to gain experience for a HR position..... without already being in that position you need to have experience of?
It's an impossible to resolve catch 22 situation and applies to far too many roles in HR.

If the same standards were applied to other situations then we’d have no doctors, lawyers, politicians, parents, bakers, swimming instructors, teachers, hairdressers, astronauts…. Well essentially everyone.


Does a HR degree and Level 7 CIPD (both of which I have) and 9 years of experience in a range of different HR roles count for nothing? Most roles state "Working towards Level 3 or 5" and I still get overlooked for even for an interview.

It's also very frustrating that I know people who don't have one/any of those two qualifications but they have somehow managed to progress further than I.

So again I ask: What the hell HR?

You might say that in the current employment market that it's understandable.... But this has been going on for two years now. I'm motivated and enthusiastic to resume my HR career, I want to be challenged and tested on a daily basis, but as the months and years receded in the rear mirror then those feelings are ever so slowly eroding....

Also, please don't say: "You need to find the right employer to give you the experience"; every employer is the right employer. Every employer can give you the experience.
It reminds me of a sign I once saw: "Bar staff needed. Previous experience required". Well if every company has that stance then eventually, you're going to run out of bar staff.

Or am I on some industry wide black list of ‘do not employ’? I'd really like to know.
(Yeah, legally these lists can’t and don’t exist. But from personal experience I know that they do….)

I’ll also questioning what’s the point in having a CIPD membership if I never use it? Surely it would be much more cost effective to cancel it and then sign back up as and when I do employed in a role that defines it as an essential requirement. Until then I’m just throwing money into the fire aren’t I?

I'm just ridiculously frustrated that I can't get any role whatsoever in a HR department and there doesn't seem to be any way for me to improve my standing. The impression I get (which has been confirmed by multiple agencies) is that I'm over qualified for entry level HR roles, by don't have enough experience for the higher roles. So I'm in a glass floor AND glass ceiling scenario PLUS the aforementioned catch 22 situation above.
God help me.

So it would seem that I have to smash my head against a closed door until I give up and go make a career in another sector..... which I don't want to do as I really, really, REALLY like working in HR.

It's just a shame that HR doesn't reciprocate those feelings.

So one final time: What the hell HR!

A very frustrated, baffled and demotivated

James

  • in reply to James Webber
    There is a very clearly defined answer. You do not have a level 7 qualification. That was conclusion of the last post and its the same now. You have a first degree - that is not level 7 - sorry thats not me saying that its the guidelines we discussed last time and that still apply.
  • in reply to Keith
    So not to be argumentative but what level am I?

    If I have no CIPD Level whatsoever then that means the CIPD is superseding the UK government education guidelines. Which can't be right.
  • in reply to James Webber
    No it isn’t. You have a level 6 qualification. That’s what a first degree is.

    The CIPD don't award a L6. But you have one awarded by a UK University. Not every professional body should or needs to award a qualification at every level.

    Sadly you do not have a L 7 qualification so claiming one may well confuse /mislead recruiters when/if they find out you don’t.
  • in reply to Keith

    And I did initially follow the advice to say that I was Level 6.

    However, very quickly this became problematic. I vividly remember sitting in an interview and literally explaining for 10 minutes what Level 6 meant and what the Government Education Scale is to the three interviewees because they didn't know. We even had a quick Q&A session afterwards. Suffice to say I didn't get the role.

    If, as you say in your initial post about a "....HR recruiters (like most managers) like narratives they can understand...." then the situation I describe is is even worse than my current predicament is it not?

    So I went back to stating I have Level 7; instead of resolving the inherent and systemic issues I simply learnt to work within them. But that's not working either......
    Granted I could've chosen to use Level 5, but I think the same situation would occur because truly speaking I don't have Level 5 either.

    P.S. It might be worth emphasising again that the degree I did achieve was certified by the CIPD i.e. they actually specified all classes and content I needed to take and also I had to submit a dissertation. So in that sense even though the CIPD may not have DIRECTLY given me the qualification I refer to, they DID certify it.

    My understanding is that my University was one of very few that could provide this.

    I would presume (although I have no specific knowledge) that the CIPD do not directly provide the courses to sit Level 3, 5 and 7 but they do specify the content and certify the criteria is met? Therefore is this not essentially the same?

  • Hi James

    An all too familiar scenario I’m afraid. I was in your position back in 2010. Tail end of the crash, with a brand new post grad in hr,now the level 7.
    I undertook a successful career change from senior operational management to full time hr. It absolutely is possible, but you have to be patient. Your first job offer will come from either someone like me or someone else that truly believes having other experiences benefits our profession, and pragmatic outlook. Please review all of the feedback above, what I’d also do is reach out to some public sector orgs to gain some work experience, this will (as in my case) was all unpaid, but you get to add it on your cv.
  • in reply to James
    Thank you for your empathy and suggestion. I will certainly look into doing that.

    It fills me with a calming perspective that I'm not alone in this type of situation, but equally frustrates me that this is allowed to continue after so many years.

    For all intents and purposes the CIPD relates to the work of administration.... and in this instance they seem to be failing at the very same thing.
  • in reply to James Webber
    Hi James thanks for posting and sorry to hear you're having such a frustrating experience getting a role in your preferred profession. You've got some great guidance here from HR practitioners but have you given the CIPD team a ring lately to discuss? www.cipd.co.uk/.../contact

    Your local branch should also be a good source of information and a great place to network. At the moment face to face meetings are not happening but there are a lot of virtual meetings going on. Johanna Social Media and Communities team.
  • in reply to James Webber
    Hi James,

    I would suggest that you do not put a CIPD level on your CV but that you state that you have a degree in HR, that will mean more to a prospective employer. It could be confusing to say that you have a level 6 CIPD qualification which does not exist as you say.

    I would also suggest potentially looking into completing a CIPD Level 7 qualification, then you can be very confident about the qualification that you have and clearly explain that to employers.
  • in reply to Charmaine Greaves
    Hi Charmaine

    That is exactly what I was thinking: James should just tell people he has a degree in HR. There's no need to attach a label to the degree that confuses people.

    @James - if I interviewed someone who said he had a level 7 qualification when he didn't, I would not be making a job offer. Also, one of the essential skills in HR is taking what can be complex information and translating it into language people can understand and that offers a practical route forward. The impression I get from your thread, however, is that you revel in creating confusion and tying people up in pointless arguments. I could be very wrong about that. I have never met you and I'm only describing the impression I have picked up from this thread but you might find it useful to know that is how you have come across to one of your readers.