Conditional offer and reference dates inconsistent with application form - General - HR in Schools and Academies

11 Conditional offer and reference dates inconsistent with application form

6 Dec, 2018 16:39

Looking from some advice please.

I have a conditional offer (references and DBS) out to a Cleaner to work in one of ours schools but having received her references the dates are out on what she has provided me with on the application form and when I asked her about this she said the ex employer had got the information wrong. I have gone back to them but as this is a central HR team it might take some time. She claims to have worked there for 5 months but the reference confirms 4 days.

I then received a glowing reference from someone she hasn't mentioned on the application form but it was from a private email address and I have my suspicions. I have a hunch that all is not well and would really like to withdraw my conditional offer based on the fact that I am unable to obtain references for a longer period of employment or a recognised employer. The DBS is back and all ok there.

I have gone back to the candidate with quite a few questions about her previous employment but have not received an answer as yet.

Am I ok to withdraw the offer or does anyone have any advice as to how I can handle this. Cleaners are extremely hard to find (good ones anyway) but I don't want to hire someone who may turn out to be a problem and also very conscious of the need to adhere to our Safer Recruitment process, which asks for at least 2 suitable references from ex employers - but does not mention how long the employee should have worked for their previous employers. Also if I withdraw the offer do I just confirm that this is due to insufficient reference information? Thank you

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Keith | 0 Posts

6 Dec, 2018 16:50

You made a conditional offer subject to receiving references satisfactory to you. You have not received these. So the conditions of the offer are not met and it falls.

It’s up to you if you think she’s worth a bet or not. Or alternatively put on hold till you get clarity from the previous employer but it would be a huge mistake to reduce five months to four days.
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Nina Waters | 0 Posts

7 Dec, 2018 07:59

The difference between 5 months and 4 days is significant - and definitely needs clarifying with the ex-employer. Is there no one you can phone about this? I certainly wouldn't accept the un-requested reference from a private individual, but if you can phone the organisation and at least clarify the dates, it would help to settle your concerns that these anomalies are adding up to something being 'not well'.

At the end of the day, you need to satisfy yourself both about her employment dates/CV and her references from recent roles, as part of your safer recruitment checks - and she's failed on both so far. If she can't provide the information you need, then you can't employ her.

Hope it all turns out well, and that the reference was a (seriously poor) typo!
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Peter Stanway | 0 Posts

7 Dec, 2018 08:00

In reply to Keith:
I would withdraw after confirmation from the 4 day employer
She may be hiding another job which also did not work out or a period of illness. Either way there is not only the trust issue but also the safeguarding problem
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Vanessa Shields | 0 Posts

7 Dec, 2018 22:46

Hello Sharon
I used to be a Screening and Vetting officer for a small security company. I carried out screening and vetting to the BS7858 standard.
When candidates provided me with reference details to obtain references on their behalf and the responses differed to what they actually provided, I would seek alternative documentation as I found that at times some companies held the incorrect information or did not have details of the individual to provide. Documents such as payslips, Bank statements showing when they were paid, P60’s, HMRC 5 year work history letter, employment contract showing their start date or a P45 which would show the date they left can also be used as evidence of employment. Hope this helps
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Sharon | 0 Posts

8 Dec, 2018 16:50

In reply to Vanessa Shields :
Thank you all for your responses really appreciated. I am going to do some more digging with the company who provided the 4 day reference to see what they come up with. I think your idea Vanessa of additional proof of working for a company are really useful but have a feeling the candidate won't have this information. It would be a good way of exploring further with them though so will give this a try. I think people underestimate the pre-employment checks required to work in a School which can appear to be extreme but absolutely necessary.
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Nina Waters | 0 Posts

10 Dec, 2018 09:33

In reply to Sharon :
Couldn't agree more Sharon - coming from previous roles outside the school sector, it's been a real learning curve!
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Kimberly | 0 Posts

11 Dec, 2018 15:45

In reply to Sharon :
Before working in schools, I worked in an environment like Vanessa that had to comply with BS7858 and I personally find schools very relaxed in their checks for new staff given they are working with children.

We check the dates for all references (we check 5 years employment history and have certain criteria for any gaps in employment). If there are any discrepancies we go back to the employee and allow them to explain. If they cannot/will not we retract the offer. If they are sincere then like Vanessa, we allow them to produce other documents to support their dates e.g. contracts, payslips, HMRC letters etc. If they cannot then we may retract the offer.

We are very clear from the beginning that safeguarding is paramount and unless history can be verified then any job offer will be withdrawn.

Even with our checks, we have successfully vetted and offered employment to a person who was homeless and unemployed for a period in the preceding 5 years - there are always alternative checks if the person is honest and willing to work with you.
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Sharon | 0 Posts

11 Dec, 2018 22:34

In reply to Kimberly:
Thanks Kimberly, I must admit we do struggle with obtaining references for candidates who have been out of the workplace for a number of years. I always ask if they know anyone from a volunteering role or someone in a professional capacity e.g. Accountant/Solicitor etc. who could provide some feedback. What would you do in a situation where the candidate does not have any referees to provide the information we need? I am trying really hard to ensure our pre-employment checks are thorough but often find it difficult where little employment history is available and consious that we do lose good candidates due to limited information.
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Vanessa Shields | 0 Posts

11 Dec, 2018 23:39

In reply to Sharon :

Sharon, ask the candidates how they supported themselves financially. I ask this question as I find that some candidates were in receipt of benefits which could always be verified by their local jobcenters, the dates they were in receipt of benefits.
Another case senario is where they stated that they were supported financially by their partners. If this was the case I would escalate this and ask senior management to decicide if the supporting evidence was satisfactory, obviously this depended on the companies policy and procedures. Again hope this helps.
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Kimberly | 0 Posts

12 Dec, 2018 07:33

In reply to Sharon :
We always ask for 2 personal references that have known the person for at least 5 years and contact these people if there are any gaps. We do stress that if these individuals are of a particular standing e.g. religious leader, police officer etc, it would aid the process. GPs do provide letters, however, they charge an admin fee for this.

As Vanessa has said, we also accept letters from the jobcenter confirming the individual was in receipt of benefits for a particular period.

In the case of the person who was homeless, they were linked with a charity for a short period so we asked for a reference from them.

If there are any gaps that aren't covered, the hiring manager has to complete a risk assessment detailing the risk and measures put in place and have this signed off by our CEO, however, we mostly use RAs when an individual has ever lived/worked abroad and we are waiting on or cannot get an overseas check (a completely different issue!).

Failing all of that, then we have to retract the job offer as we cannot complete the checks. But in all honesty, we've only had to do this a few times and it was for candidates that didn't seem too fussed about the job.
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Lewis Longford | 0 Posts

17 Jun, 2019 12:08

In reply to Vanessa Shields :
Hello Sharon, I am interested to hear your thoughts on BS7858. I am currently reviewing a process for my companies Cyber security team and they are really keen for us to implement BS7858 standards pretty much as of yesterday. I am having difficulty finding the exact basic requirements of the standard and trying to understand if any of these elements can be done internally. We use a checking service for DBS and finance checks but i am interested to know how far we have to go with the other elements of the standard. When you search online there just seem to be hundreds of companies offering to screen and they all seem to be very expensive. I would really appreciate some thoughts on this!
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